Tuesday, July 01, 2008

"Wee sleekit cowerin timr'ous beasties"

I sometimes wonder if Burns was writing about mice when he wrote that line or, did he have a premonition about the SNP ?

My last two posts of June 30th. and June 29th. have received 7 hostile comments about the June 30th. article re. 'Scotland's dignity' so what ? I hear you ask, nothing new there then.

I would point out though that they all have something in common, not one of them addresses the issue written about in the June 30 th. article, not one of them.
They all want to rehash old accusations, make personal attacks on Wendy Alexander and generally talk about anything but the behaviour of the SNP and it's latest yes man Keith (be umble keif be umble) Brown.

Scotland and it's parliament has been shamed by this man and the SNP and none of them can face up to it so, no surprise there then eh ? please read the article again and then read the posts from these SNP men or, is it mice.


David Duff said...

Ferret-fighting in a sack - such fun! Can't wait 'til you lot get your independence, then you'll be able to give up this pretend stuff and have a proper set-to - goody-goody!

Daniel Dravot said...

Re-arrange the following words:

horse, flogging, you, dead, are.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(David Duff) 12:24
What you are seeing is mild stuff, it seems bad to you because you have no tradition of fighting.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Daniel Dravot) 12:26

You are flogging dead horse.

Is English your first language ?

Still running away then.

The Aberdonian said...

Question councillor - what if the shoe was on the other foot and it was Salmond in the frame? Do you think Labour would have shown mercy?


The Labour Party, an organisation that:

1- Harrassed Winnie Ewing in Parliament after the Hamilton by-election.

2- Tried to ban the SNP from having party political broadcasts

3 - Banned until the 1990's an SNP delegate at the Cenotraph, in particular naval veteran and Western Isles MP Donald Stewart.

And the abuse from friends (not even metted out to Sinn Feinn) in the media right up to the present day.

You are right. People remember. If you beat something long enough they bite back. It is not pleasent.

For the record I do think Wendy was hard done by and she was taking Labour in a more progressive direction. So was McLeish but it was his own party who knived him. But that is politics - your enemies behind you and your opponents to the side (Holyrood)/front (Westminster) of you.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

aberdonian 1/7/8 13.00 pm

I have already said and I say again, if this Keith Brown character was in the Labour Party he would be finished.

I predict that his future in the SNP will be assured.

Yes there is a difference between us.

Macnasty said...

Councillor , no one has addressed the issues in this post because you didn't raise any.

What you did was portray Wendy as a wronged Mother Theresa when a bang to rights Winnie Mandela would have been a more accurate fit.

And why no denial that there's more to come out about her resignation, that there's even more Scottish Labour sleaze lurking in the undergrowth and that your by-election chances are not good.

Maybe you could also share your views on why the Member for Glasgow East resigned so inconveniently for the Government?

Anonymous said...

'His future in the SNP is assured.'

What price the future Lord Vaz getting a promotion in the Labour party then, Terry?

Dont you think that the Hon Member swallowed his principles on 42 days with indecent haste at the first whiff of ermine?

I always thought Hoon was an incompetent clown and his writing that note to Vaz has set my opinion in concrete.

A verdict on Labours eleven years in power? - Sleazy, incompetent and stupid.

Nick said...

Politicians pursuing a tribal vendetta against their party's opponents? Surely not!

No wonder voters are disillusioned with the democratic process. All we are presented with with are snide ad hominem attacks, fraudulent financial arrangements and poorly thought-out legislation designed to act as a dog whistle to the reactionary press. Or worse, to show how 'tough' a politician is.

As for saying the SNP are worse than Labour because this chap will have an assured career despite some underhand politicking, I'd point you to Alistair Campbell and his Machiavellian role in Blair's government. Pot, here's your old friend kettle.

Frankly, you all seem to be as venal, incompetent and feckless as each other.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Macnasty) 01/07/08
I wrote two posts about the standards committee in Holyrood and you haven’t mentioned it.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 12:34

I wrote about the behaviour of the standards committee in Holyrood ?

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Nick) 15:23

“Frankly, you all seem to be as venal, incompetent and feckless as each other”

How about ‘they are only in it for what they can get’ or ‘you can’t believe a thing a politician tells you’ you might be onto something here.

What about the issue I posted about ?

Anonymous said...

Councillor 6.19

You wrote about the behaviour of the Standards Committee and I wrote about the behaviour of a politician with 'form' and an incredibly stupid Chief Whip.

Without the crass arrogance of politicians in general and the latter two (three, including Wendy) in particular, the Standards Committee would be redundant.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 19:00

I’m still patiently waiting for one of you lot to address the issue I wrote about.

“Scots Wha Hae wae Wallace” come on join in.

Macnasty said...

Terry, you're flogging a deceased parrot with this 'Shame Wendy got busted,' thing, so let's change the subject - What do you know about funding for the Glasgow Science Park?

It's the funding that was in place I'm curious about, not the recent cuts.

Nick said...

Alright then, let's get substantive. You said:

"Scotland and it's parliament has been shamed by this man and the SNP and none of them can face up to it so, no surprise there then eh ?"

I'd argue that the broader point here is that political discourse has become almost totally debased to the point where this incident doesn't really stand out as unusual.

It's not just the SNP that shame British politics with a bit of partisan nastiness; there are bigger issues such as the dishonesty of the case for war in Iraq, the disdain MPs show for transparency and the boys' club nature of parliamentary exchanges.

In the face of a more general malaise, do you think anyone cares about a case of backstabbing by a ruling party? We've become used to it. In the political climate New Labour have fostered - the rise of smear tactics, press manipulation and cynical dealings - why does it surprise you that some grubby little nationalist can get away with a bit of sharp practice?

This one incident hasn't shamed politics: it's already in the mire. What would you do to raise the standards of British politics to a point where the abuse of a process to oust a rival merits more than a shrug and a 'Meh, they're at it again...'?

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Nick) 03/07/08

“this incident doesn't really stand out as unusual” This incident does stand out, I don’t think the Labour Party, the Tories or the Lib. Dems. Would have accepted this man’s behaviour.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Nick) 03/07/08

“this incident doesn't really stand out as unusual” This incident does stand out, I don’t think the Labour Party, the Tories or the Lib. Dems. Would have accepted this man’s behaviour.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Macnasty) 02/07/08

You keep going back to the ‘Wendy thing’ because you know I’m right.

I don’t know anything about a science park, I’ve been away for two weeks.

Nick said...

Probably a bit late for this thread, but I want to respond anyway...

I think parties of all stripes are more than happy to rig votes or abuse the parliamentary system for partisan gain. For example, Michael Meacher's been very good at supressing anti-Government speakers in the House of Commons (even those from Labour's back benches). Is that fair play?

Anyway, you didn't address my broader point about the tarnished reputation of politics in this country. Anything to say about that?

Nick said...

Whoops, I meant Michael Martin in the last post. Michael Meacher, of course, at least had the courage of his convictions, saying "New Labour does not believe in capitalism".

He was later sacked.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

There are no major political parties who don’t believe in Capitalism only individual members of parties like me.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Nick) 12:28

Like any other walk of life there are good and bad people involved, I can only speak on a personal basis about Labour and the overwhelming majority of people that I’ve dealt with in approx 40 yrs. have been decent and honest.

Your description of politics suggests a lack of knowledge of the subject, the truth is that it’s not easy to rig votes as you suggest.

Nick said...

Oh, I don't know... Isn't ensuring the 'right result' is obtained in parliamentary votes what the whip system exists for?

And how about buying the votes of other parties as Brown did over 42 days' detention? Traditional Labour politics don't usually sit so well with the DUP wingnuts...

In case you think I'm linking just to Tory papers, here's The Guardian and The Indie on the same stroy. "Pork barrel politics", eh?

I take your point about good and bad people being involved in all industries. My old MP in Nottingham was one of the good guys at a local level. But at national level, these good guys seem to be reduced to quiet mumbling on the back benches. Why is it only the unprincipled that make it to the front bench?

Anyway, you've once again dodged the point of the continuing abasement of politics in Britain. Turn-outs are falling and politicians enjoy less trust than ever. Does politics have an image problem, or is there something rotten in the state of Denmark?

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Nick) 25/07/08

Politics is being Americanised. The more money you have the more power you will have. Brian Souter is a good but not only example.

What we need is a socialist revolution, I wonder what Fidel is doing now that he has time on his hands ?

Nick said...

Not sure we need a socialist revolution, but I'd agree something has to change. Maybe reducing the bureaucratic class, straightening out the imcredibly complex tax and benefits system to give people more of their own cash and bringing in PR would be a start?

Or a bloodless coup like the Velvet Revolution to return a level of self-determination to the people.

I'd imagine Fidel's a bit past staging revolutions these days! Perhaps the Chinese can spare one of Mao Zedong's successors to come over here and shake things up a bit?

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Nick) 08:52
If you ever see a picture of the Knesset in session you might see some guys dressed in long flowing black robes with long flowing hair an long flowing beards and black pointed wizard type hats, about 3 or 4 of them. They are ultra religious Jews who want to live the way they did 2,000 years ago, no doubt nice guys, kind to kids and animals. They are very powerful people and the Knesset has to listen to what they say.

In Renfrewshire Council Labour won the majority of the popular vote by approx. 1,500 the SNP were second and we had 17 seats each. The Tories came third in the popular vote with two seats and the Lib. Dems. came last but got 4 seats. The Lib. Dems. Are now in power with the SNP and Labour and the Tories are in opposition.

Both of these two scenarios are the result of PR, Italy e.g. has I think had approx. 50 Governments since the war 60 years ago and Fascism is once again on the rise in that country, yes they have had PR for 60 yrs.
Please don’t tell me about PR.