Saturday, January 03, 2009


Israel V Palestine The latest results.

Israel 500 killings - Palestine 4 killings.

"You can't beat a fair equal fight can you" (Ehud Barak Israel Defence Minister)


Anonymous said...

People are getting killed and maimed in Gaza and you equate it to some kind of match - Israel 500 vs Palestinians 4

This is despicable even by your loathsome standards you obscene little man

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 03/01/09

I wish I could claim credit for it but I can’t.

I noticed it written on a placard being waved by a pro Palestinian protestor and I thought, “What a brilliant way of pointing out the one sided nature of the Israeli crimes and the desperate plight of the Palestinians” and it is, and your comment seems more than a little insincere.

Anonymous said...

'I noticed it ...being waved by a pro-Palestinian protestor.'

So it may not even be true, but you still published it?

Never been big on facts, have you Councillor?

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 19:40



Anonymous said...

Councillor, the IDF are now inside Gaza, getting up close and personal with the murdering b******* who have been rocketting Israeli towns for years. An irritable Israeli with a bayonet is not at all hi-tech, believe me.

a very public sociologist said...

A massacre in the Middle East is going on, and all some brain dead drone can do is use it to make a cheap political point against the owner of this blog. Pathetic.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 04/01/09
Over the past 7 years thousands of home made Palestinian rockets have been fired killing 4 I believe Israelis’; somehow last week, more rockets were fired, again without any loss of Israeli life and suddenly all hell broke loose and there are now 550 and rising Palestinians dead with thousands injured and 4 Israelis’ dead.

Have you even bothered to consider why this happened, are you so stupid or prejudiced that you don’t grasp it ? are you even aware that there is a general election imminent in Israel ? are you evil or dumb; which is it ?

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(a very public sociologist) 11:26
The “brain dead drone” had the obvious choice of a “cheap political point” or an argument in support of Israel; or even a call for a cease fire, I find that rather enlightening.

Jim Lewis said...

Well done Terry. I see that you've now stopped calling anonymous psoters cowards and SNP supporters. A sign of maturity.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Jim Lewis) 16:09
Oh no I haven’t, when they stop abusing me I will stop retaliating, them’s the rules which you well know Jim.

Anonymous said...

I don't think the "Israel vs Palestine" comment was despicable. Flippant, but not despicable. Unfortunately not everyone follows current affairs or is interested in international politics, and sometimes an issue needs to be presented in not-too-fine a manner for people to really see exactly what is happening.
Politics needs to be more accessible to a wider audience, and deep and lengthy political debate isn't always the way to do it.

Jim Lewis said...

Sorry, Tel, I realise you don't do irony. It seems that anonymous postings are meaningless unless they agree with you. I'll try being monosyllabic more often.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Jim Lewis) 10:55
Jim you sometimes wrong foot me which is entertaining, I don’t know if it’s as a result of your condition when you sit down to write but keep it up.
Nevertheless you should reconsider this statement, I print anonymous comments, those I agree with and those I don’t.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Anonymous) 05/01/09
“and sometimes an issue needs to be presented in not-too-fine a manner for people to really see exactly what is happening”

Absolutely, that is why we have thousands of brutal images from Gaza in the form of cartoons in newspapers/magazines all over the world, my critic is clearly too concerned at having a go at me. And it certainly wasn’t flippant, it was quite deliberately designed to highlight the disproportionate Israeli retaliation which of course still murderously thunders on.

Macnasty said...

Kelly, I see another member of the Paisley Popular Front has taken time out from knitting his own lentils to comment on this post.

Perhaps both of you have a view on this: In the 5 months Jan-June 2008 almost 3000 rockets were fired from Gaza into Israel. What do you think would constitute a 'proportional' response to these attacks?

Jim Lewis said...

Again, you miss my point. As you well know, any anonymous comment that in any way disagrees with your world view almost invariably is met with a diatribe about anonymity and cowardice, whereas anonymous postings agreeing with you isn't. My own preference would be for a little humility now and then. Sometimes, you get facts wrong and you need, in my opinion, to take that on the chin. When you're in more magnanimous mood, your standard of debate rockets. As we've just discovered, there are a couple of issues on which we unreservedly agree. I guess what I'm saying is that the fact that others can drag a debate into the mire doesn't require us to follow suit.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Macnasty) 14:54
Which one of the 3000 was the rocket which caused this carnage ? is it coincidence that a general election looms and the sitting Govt. have still not recovered from the fight with Hezbolah ? are you stupid or disingenuous ?

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Jim Lewis) 15:22
I have to disagree; I always start out with the intention of having a proper debate, notwithstanding someone commenting in reasonable language that e.g. what we need is an Adolph Hitler to run the country. In such a case the type of language is irrelevant.

Anyone who writes anonymously or otherwise will be treated properly, I can be as cordial and reasonable as the next man and I can be abrupt and hostile as well, the commenter sets the tone in these exchanges not me, I don’t object to robust debate within reason, how could I ? I’m hardly a shrinking violet.

Macnasty said...

Kelly, you called the Israeli response 'disproportionate.'

I ask you again: What is a 'proportionate' response to 3000 rockets targetting your people?'

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Macnasty) 17:57
Proportionate = similar

- To start talking about a proportionate response you would have to start with both sides being equal, that would mean normal? conditions in Gaza, water, electricity, hospitals, schools, mosques, roads, access and egress, goods, sewerage, no apartheid wall, recognition of the democratically elected Govt. of Hamas, control of their own land, sea and air space etc. etc.
A proportionate response to either side showing aggression would then be a similar action i.e. an identical rocket fired into an identical target with an identical outcome you really are pretty simple aren’t you, now, are you going to try an answer to my points ?

Pauline said...

I am the first to admit I know little of the history of this conflict. For the benefit of those who have issues with those who post anonymously, it was me who posted the comment on Jan 5th @ 8.43pm.
Despite my shameful lack of knowledge regarding this conflict, one would have to assume that there is some degree of inequality or disproportion when you consider that the Palestinian death toll has reached 629, whilst the Israeli death toll is 9 (not that I would in any way condone those 9 Israeli deaths any more than I would condone the 629 Palestinian deaths)

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Pauline) 19:39
Pauline – you have placed on record what most people who don’t know the history of the conflict are thinking and saying, you have done so more eloquently than I ever could.

You have told the simple truth and done so without bias, you don’t see sides, to your credit, you see tragedy and dead children, whose children they are does not matter, they are dead children.

Jim Lewis said...

Pauline, you missed out the fcat that of the 9 Isreali deaths, 4 of them were killed in a 'friendly fire' incident. MacNasty, if you need to know what disporoportion is about, how about one Israeli death from rocket fire in the months leading up to the invasion? How about an act of piracy in international waters, when an aid carrying ship was rammed by the Israeli Navy while going about its lawful business? How about clousre of the aid corridor from Egypt to Gaza? I find it laughable that anyone should be concerned about the lawless behaviour, which is indisputable, of Hamas, while totally ignoring the fact tha Israel has shown a complete disregard for law, domestic and international. Unlike Terry, I don't accuse the Isrealis of war crimes, simply on the basis that they aren't at war with Gaza. They don't need to be, because they hold all the cards. However, their breaches of human rights, just like their breaches of Israeli and International Law over a great many years are not in dispute. In their latest cowardly attack on two UN schools, the grid references of which they admit to having been given, is clear evidence of how much they care. Luckily for the Gazans, the Israeli people are starting take back their country.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(Jim Lewis) 09:31
More and more people and agencies around the world are referring to this as a war including Israel; and tonight calls were being made to put the Israeli war criminals on trial when it’s over, I support that in the same way as I would support the trial of any other war criminal.

BTW Has anyone heard any Israeli explanation of why they rammed the boat carrying medical supplies, is that a war crime?

mother abigail said...

I think it is correct that if anyone in this war is cupable then they should stand accused of war crimes.

When a country attacks or invades any other country without a clear reason that can be justified, then the perpetrators should be brought to justice. Do you agree Terry?

Macnasty said...

The gospel according to Kelly, 'It's Ok to fire rockets at someone, provided that they are not very good rockets.'

Are you saying that the rockets fired from Gaza were not intended to kill Iraelis?

While totally agreeing that the death of children is unacceptable, let's not forget that these are the people who turned a 13year old into a suicide bomber. I find this unbelievably evil. Do you also condemn it?

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(mother abigail) 08/01/09
Anyone committing war crimes should be brought to justice.
Any country which attacks or invades another country without a justifiable reason should be brought to justice.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

“It's Ok to fire rockets at someone, provided that they are not very good rockets”

I’m not sure what the quality of the rockets has to do with anything and I certainly never said anything like that but, since it’s you and you find these things difficult I’ll try again.

It is absolutely OK to fire rockets at someone if you have a good enough reason, with the intention of course of killing your enemy, just like the Palestinians are doing.

“A 13year old into a suicide bomber, do you also condemn it” Yes.

“I find this unbelievably evil” People like you do not have the moral right to describe anyone as evil. Based on what I know of you I would far rather align myself with the moral code of the Palestinians.

If anyone stands accused of evil it is the Israeli’s.

Who was it that really turned people into suicide bombers?

mother abigail said...

As I said before Terry. When do you think the Labour government will be brought to Justice for invading Iraq with over 10000 civilians killed in the process?

With no justifiable reason to do so.

And you speak of war crimes!

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(mother abigail) 09:27
Why are you running away from the Gaza conflict ?

mother abigail said...

I am running away from nothing Terry.

I clearly stated my position on Gaza

"I think it is correct that if anyone in this war is culpable then they should stand accused of war crimes."

I am not sure that I know enough of the history to make an informed judgement on it, however, when a country fires missiles at you indiscriminately then I believe you are entitled to a recourse of action to stop them.

So tell me Terry do you agree that the Labour goverment should be brought to justice for invading Iraq with no justification or evidence that there was a threat to British safety.

Cllr Terry Kelly said...

(mother abigail) 13:19
When I write about Gaza and you write back about Iraq you are running away.

Not only are you running away you are displaying that you have your own different agenda which is anti Labour, you clearly couldn’t care less about casualties in Gaza or Iraq the only casualties you are interested in are Labour ones.

I would agree that anyone who invades another country with no Justification or evidence of a threat from that country should be brought to justice but that is not the Labour Govt.